Comparison of weight of groupsets for the weighty weenies

Wheels of Happiness

Rizal Philippines
January 29,2017

                                            Magaan subalit mahal   mga P140,000 php Red 22

I compiled a list of the weight  of the groupsets. I am repeating that if you want to a have light bike (a light bike translates into an efficient and sometimes fast bike)  If you must upgrade, its not only the looks or the brand but consider  the weight:(cost to weight ratio)

        1.    Frame sets

          Not all carbon frames are light review of a carbon frame circa 2011 showed a carbon built bike
          weighing 8kg +.  The Bianchi of some of RBP are said to be tipping the scales at 8.5 kg.  Some alum
          bikes by Cannondale, Giant Merida are light.

     2.  Wheelsets

         Typical wheelsets weigh over 2 kg.  Some more expensive branded weigh over 1.85 kg, those over
         P15,000 tip the scales at 1.7 kg.   Most carbon frames are 1.5 kg.   The branded ones are at 1.5kg.
         Am Cla came out with 1.4+ kg alum wheelsets.  The 350 and 420.   Light bikes.   Even Ursu, the
         Italian company have wheelsets weighing in at 1.6 kg.  But they have beautiful wheels   Aero wheelsets
         are expensive but their wind cheating features are what you pay for.  at 30+ kph, your ability to cut
         through the air is what counts, not the weight.

         Orig 450 carbon wheelset weighs 1,500 grams. SRP is at P30 k.

       Novatec Jetfly (which I bought) weighs 1,435 gtrams making my Freccia really sub 8 kg alum bike.

       Some Italian carbon fiber wheelsets weigh 1,300 grams and cost over P130K.

   3.  Group sets:    Component Weight Comparison from Total Cycling

        There are three major manufacturers:  Shimano, Campagnolo and SRAM. Their average weight is
        2 kg;   Shimano group sets are heavier, Campy is lighter than Shimano, and SRAM is the lightest.
        SRAM was the first with SRAM red 22 to be sub 2 kg.  (1.7kg)

        Weight comparison

        1. Shimano                                                                     PHL price

           105                               2.498 grams                         P18,000

           Ultegra 6800 8000        2,294 grams                           30,000

           Durace   9000               1,998 grams                           64,000

Some of the lightest bikes are Fuji SL bikes

Wheels of Happiness

Rizal Philippines
January 28, 2017

Fuji launches superlight bikes
I rode to Jalajala today on a Fuji campy with Cosmic wheelset. The  repainted reassembled is not yet road worthy (having some problems with bottom bracket)  I said earlier that I was a fool wanting a Scott or Wilier not realizing that my bike is much much lighter than those mentioned.

I rode with someone who has a Fuji SL too (much latest version) with Durace.  and he  advised  me against disposing off the Fuji bike.  Sayang.

Fuji has consistently been in the list of lightest bikes. Their latest is only 695 grams and they together with SRAM red produced at sub 5 kg bike.

   600 grams frame and  sub 5 built bike 5 figure price

N.B.   I tried to lift a famous Italian bike with Cosmic carbon wheelset and Durace group set. I would say it must be over 8 kg.  My Freccia with its 1,435 Novatec wheelset  would be lighter (sub 8 kg estimate)

Practice ride to Jalajala despite the heavy rains

Wheels of Happiness

Rizal Philippines
January 28, 2018

I slept up to 7 pm today since 4 pm (after eating, washing the bike, minding the dirty jersey and shoes)  I must have worked hard in my ride today to Jalajala Rizal.  I got soaked up in the rain.  I defied the pundits who said it is not good to go because of the dark clouds at the East. I persisted because I had to build up the mileage for the Vigan ride.

There was no rain even at Halayhayin Pililla.  Only light shower in Quisao up to Malaya.  But it rained hard very hard in Jalajala.  I had to go on lest I get cold and have rayuma.

Some interesting stories:

1.  I overtook two young riders (formerly Argonauts pala) going up to Callahan. They overtook me  again but passed them again at the flats from Cardona Morong boundary. At Morong town proper, they counterf lowed and left me

2.  A pack of fast riders including a Nebres rider (who came from abroad and rode a MTB) overtook me, but I stuck with them for 5 km from Baras to km 57.   Haha kaya ko palang bumontot sa halimaw.

3.  In Cardona, going up to the Looc hill (past Iglesia) a pair of MTB on 1 x 11 gearset overtook me on  fast clip and I gave chase.  Overtook them (they are not supposed to be overtaken because they are on very low gears) They caught up with me again at the diversion intersection.  There I stood on the pedals and left them behind

4.  I did the trip going home on a 50 chain ring x 13 on the flats and even went up the hills on 50.  50 x 17 or 19.   Dati hindi ko kaya ang ganong hard rings.

5.  My Fuji bike was with two other Fuji bikes this morning at Simple:  Fuji Roubaix and another  one na mas mahal.   Fuji bikes are truly light.   I lifted a PInarello and it must have weighed 8 kg ++

I was not a bad aSS.  I had dirty ass from the tilamsik of the  tires.  Very wet warmer, jersey, socks and Scott shoes that failed.  The carbon sole and the upper separated and I could not uncleats, I nearly fell.

Some advice when you have your bike repainted

Wheels of Happiness

Rizal Philippines
January 26,2018

I had my road bike repainted. It was a great opportunity to review the mechanics of a bike and clean it thoroughly. There is much accumulated amount of dirt at the bolts, inside the bottom bracket,bearings head set, at the RD, the pulleys the  brakes.  It was chance for me to detail and clean them one by one.

On the repainting as I was reassembling the bike  I must admit I made a lot  of omission and that which I say must be done prior to repainting, or before reassembling:

1. Mask cover the bottom bracket shell so that there will be pain spray or drops inside the shell which contains the thread. I spent a great deal of time cleaning the threads kasi ayaw pumasok at humigpit ang bb (ISIS drive0

2. Mask the seat tube, seat post and the fork part that meets the bottom of the frame set.

3.  Cover mask the  painted parts before assembling.  May scratches na newly painted frame after the assembly.

I would say the straight painters are careless... Di asikaso ang mangyayari sa mag aassemble o sa mechanical parts when they overspray.

Getting a great value for money for SRAM group set

Wheels of Happiness

Rizal Philippines
January 26, 2018

Actual pictures

As preparation for my forthcoming OEM Bianchi Oltre bike, I tried to look for  a group set that would be worthy the bike that will be bought

I thought of Ultegra R8000. But at P30,000 (I can get from online at P29,000)  It weighs 2,200 grams+ We can get an equivalent value same weight 6800.  Some say you can get a good value at P17,000 but  none can give a quote. I nearly got one from Mars Kingdome at P21,000 but changed their mind and upped the price to P25,000. I would rather get an R8000

Eto sayang, from whom I bought the SRAM red, he sold his Durare for only P34,000 (50% of the current price of  Durace)

SRAM red for Sale -Bike Parts for Sale

And then I saw this ad last Sunday evening. Posted in November selling a SRAM red group I texted and pm him and he called me up. I saw the parts last Wed,  He gave me a senior citizen discount.

Today I paid the amount and got the parts. The SRAM red weighs 1975 grams and is lighter than Durace. My problem will be the bottom bracket that is special since the drive side is 24 mm and the non drive side is 22 mm.  Riders, former student who use it swear by the crisp shifts, and better braking. It takes some doing though getting used to double tap:  short tap for downshift (high gear) and long tap for upshift (low gear)

I bought a group set at 1/4 I would have paid for Durace, and 1/2+ for what I would have paid for Ultegra. I am so happy for my achievement today  Thanks sir Bjay.  for the opportunity and the senior citizen discount

More pictures

                                                   170 mm carbon fiber crank

                                                     BB 30  fit

                                              Stunning graphics at the  crank arm, solid
                                                       aluminum crank axle

                                                        Inalis ang rubber hood to get a better
                                                                     of the shifter

                                                     Kinalawang na ang lugar ng handle bar attachment
                                                                    nut

                                             Deep scratch in front top of the shifter

                                                 FD shifter body, ti daw?  at may yaw?
\

                                            RD with ceramic bearing and 1:1 actuation for
                                                       crisp precise shifts  (vs 1.4:1 sa shimano)

                                                     Group set from solid alum billet

                                       Note uneven spacing of teeth at 4 quadrants of the 26 cog

                                         BB 30 bearing, circlip and shims for US bike attachment

                                                       Front brakes

                                                            Sram Chains

The SRAM group set have beautiful and attractive graphics and are lightweight. The red group is lighter than a Durace.   However I got mine for a bargain for many reasons:   may mga deep scratches, mga kinalawang, and because the seller like Atty Fortun was generous and was kind to senior citizen.  Salamat sir.  Bjay.

Benefits and advocacies for RBP members

Wheels of Happiness

Rizal Philippines
January 25,2018

There were two inspirations for this article.

1. We were given up to 10% discount at Missing Link bike shop as Vhen a kapadyak was making DP for Ridley Fenix alum bike (may sale sila) .  Allan Flores who posts about the sale at RBP is an RBP group member.And as I thanked Allan, he said, or Missing Link answered, "basta rbp may discount". That is heartwarming

Why not have bikeshop that posts at RBP group site give the same privilege to other RBP members? That will generate more goodwill for the seller, and more reason why other bikers must be members of RBP.

2.  Atty Fortun and some other ka RBP are giving away old bike parts (but useful and usable) - brakes, helmets,shoes, water bottle that some less fortunate kapadyak, RBP ians can use. They do contest or beauty contest, or sometimes invitation for bawas kalat.

   Other members can do the same to encourage more  bike rides.

Other advocacies:

1.  Road safety:

      1.  Keep 1.5 meters  off riders

      2.  Road sharing

     3. Petition for better bike lanes (legislation)

2.  Use of bikes as mass transport: (legislation)

   1.  Ride to work benefits:     (legislation)

             1.  Vat tax exemptions who buy bikes for work

             2.  Loans from employers

             3. Financing from lending companies

3. Bikers for disaster relief work:

           1. Donations and contributions

          2. Volunteers for relief and rescue work

Marami na tayo 100,000. We can be big force to reckon with. Baka makapag elect tayo ng party list Congressman.  Atty. Fortun,, puwede kaba para makapagpasa ng batas na pro bikers.

This would require an organization, a secretariat for :

1. Membership registration

2. Issuance of membership cards

3. Discount agreement

4.  Events and other work

   

Why fear China made carbon fiber components?

Wheels of Happiness

Rizal Philippines
January 24, 2018

The post on carbon fiber bought by Ed de los Reyes from Lazada drew a number of comments, some of them expressing fear of breakage because it is from China  I dare say, there is no need for worry.

The Toseek the TCTH brand in China might be trusted name all ready testing the  Phil market.

Are you aware that FSA (Full Speed Ahead) GTS, SRAM are Taiwan based? And yet do you fear their failures.    China manufacturing has come of age and many of their products can be trusted and are reliable.  Sige matakot kayo. Enjoy lang kami ng murang piyesa.

1. What is carbon fiber material?

    It is space material that is 3x lighter than steel but 3x stronger. It is made by impregnating carbon fiber with resin having this dried naturally or baked.  Vacuum is employed to remove bubbles while the polymer is drying.  It is very much doing things with fiber glass.

   While it is very strong, it is also very brittle. We see formula cars breaking into small bits when they crash. The nice thing about carbon fiber is that it can be shaped, to any shape you want.    The biggest source of carbon fiber is in Asia with most of the supply dominated by Toray, based in Japan

Properties of Carbon fiber

10 things you many not know about Carbon Fiber

2. Hence most of the carbon fiber supplier are also from Asia:   2/3 of world"s  supply is from Mitsubishi.  Toray is the most popular brand Taiwan and China.  Most OEM suupliers are in Taiwan and China.  OEM means original equipment manufacturer. They are outsourcing, subcontractor of say Italian or UK bike sellers/marketers:  they make the frame in Taiwan with specs coming from UK or Italy OEM ship them back without label  but maybe painted, and the branded supplier brands the frames.  In other words, the technology to make the frame is in Taiwan and China

Asia Pacific supplied 40% of worlds carbon fiber with China  and Japan leading the way followed by Taiwan and South Korea

Many bike manufacturers lack the capability to make carbon fiber parts/frames.

The most reliable and experienced carbon fiber parts manufacturer are from Taiwan and China.  They have big factories molds and oven. They know what they are doing.

Making carbon fiber parts is not big deal. Again, it is like making fiber glass. I know of subcontractors who make carbon fiber exhaust for MC and exports them to Singapore.  We have local manufacturers who make carbon wheels (carbo nation) CNC and many repairs are undertaken by them. What frames  wheel set or components do they repair? China or orig?   All breakdown.  We see videos of carbon wheel set exploding as the riders run over a dog, or bikes disintegrating  after a crash.    Are they China made or original

Carbon fiber has an inherent weakness;  it has a lot of bawal:

    1.  Heat
    2.  Pressure. Do not clamp the bike on a bike stand.  So most breakdown occur at TT where the
         bikes are held by bike stand;
   3.  Corrosion:  where metal and carbon fiber meet as the attachment of water bottle and frame, the FD the seat post.    Some say that it has 5 year expiry period What is the life span of carbon fiber frames? Most manufacturers give a five (5) year warranty.  But most say especially the CF engineers that CF can actually last you a  lifetime.

   Some warning:

   1. Avoid buying 2nd hand frame;  sellers also do not give warranty;  they cant warrnt anything on carbon
       fiber

  2.  Avoid cf bikes used under too much stress:   off road,  rugged roads, racing. They are likely to be damaged at the stays.  Inspect very carefully when buying.

  3. Do not keep your bike in the car under the heat of the sun for long.

  4.  If you have carbon fiber bike, avoid cooking your brakes, whether it is aluminum or carbon brake line.  The heat is likely to degrade the carbon fiber.

  5.  Some carbon frames might be heavier than alum or other alloy.

  6. Watch for signs of corrosion especially where metal and carbon fiber meet:    seat post, braze on on for FD. That is where due to galvanic corrosion,  weakness, and cracks begin to appear

Can I further reduce the weight of 6600 by changing the shifters and the RD, FD with Force parts

Wheels of Happiness

Rizal Philippines
January 18, 2018

I just saw a post of Rival shifters for sale  at 8,500 with RD (kulang FD)

How much weight can be saved:   From Total Cycling - Component Weights

                                        Ultegra                           SRAM Force                 Savings

                    Shifter          419                                307 grams                      112 grams

                    FD                86                                   77                                    9 grams

                    RD              193                                 166                                  27 grams

                   Brakes          340                                 278                                 62 grams

                                                                                                    Total         210 grams

                                                                                           7,509 -  210  = 7,299  =   16,057 lbs

I all ready closed a deal with Kirk of Bago City to sell me his SRAM force for an undisclosed amount.  Kung aabutin ko ng February. I planned to upgrade to 6700 Ultegra with no change in weight.   For some K more, I would be able to save 200 grams. Parang bumili ng wheelset na magaan.

Nice and very light handle bar from Lazada by Ed de los Reyes

Wheels of Happiness

Rizal Philippines
January 24, 2018

I passed by the  house of Ed de los Reyes in Cardona and saw his newly acquired carbon fiber drop bar. it is so nice with holes for cables and very light. The ads say it is only 240 grams.  Imagine that. Some alum drop bar would be in 400 to 500 grams weight.   Who cares whether it is from China or  Lazada.  Magaan at Maganda naman

3K Glossy Carbon Fiber bike no logo from Lazada

New bike technologies that we should be familiar with

Wheels of Happiness

Rizal Philippines
January 24, 2018

There are at least 3 new bike technologies that we should be aware of and be updated with:

1. Press fit bottom brackets (we have been used only to Shimano threaded BB.)  Now there are BB30 and press fit.  I encountered a Red SRAM that uses press fit system

2. Thru axle. We have been used to thin spindles with QR. But now we see fork and rear stay with holes instead of U slot and with axles that fit perfectly through the hole and the hub body.

Thru Axle from Bike Bug

Thru Axle video

3.  Direct mount brakes that are single pivot instead of dual, and bolted with two bolts instead of one.
     directly bolted onto the fork or the rear stays.  Some are installed  at the underneath the chain stay (near
     the BB)  They say the direct mount brakes work better. There is no fade and there is no need for center -
     ing because both of the calipers are fixed;.  The brakes are lighter too they say.

    The Bianchi bikes are exposing us to the new tech.

BT Win direct mount brakes

Investing in carbon fiber frame may not be the only or best way to have a fast light bike

Wheels of Happiness

Rizal Philippines
January 23,2018

Buying an expensive carbon fiber bike frame may not be the only and the best way to make your bike lighter and consequently go faster.  There are other ways.  A bike frame investment could be as little as P20t if you buy unbranded from Lazada. or on the average P30t if you buy second hand, from OEM importers from Cebu, CDO Antipolo City (P39k doon)

1.  Carbon fiber frame may not be  the lightest.  Carbon fiber bike frame does not necessarily mean lighter bike. Some older models may be heavier than alum or your  existing bike.    Like in the  current sale, their cheapest weighs 1.2 kg.  Same as some Giant, or Caad 8 frames. You may actually be going higher in  cost and weight.   The high end frame may be in the vicinity of P70k and that means they weigh under 1 kg.

  Carbon fiber or alum frame?

2. Carbon fiber wheelset  may not also be the lightest.   Rim height of 3.5 cm or more require more materials and hence contribute to more weight.  Aero has another purpose -  to cut through the wind resistance and thus save you watts and increase your speed.   Aero also works if your speed is beyond 30kph.  Now if you ride at 20 kph.... Some alum bikes are lighter than carbon fiber wheelsets.  And wheelsets with carbon fiber brake line become ugly and dirty over time and suffer degradation in wet conditions.  Should you stick to your alum wheelsets?

AmCla wheelsets are known to be light and sub 1.5 kg.  I got a wheelset that is only 1,435 grams.  A fulcrum quattro weighs 1.7kg.  Some name brands are heavy .   The Colnago Bora 2 which will save you additional 200 grams costs more than P100K.  That is P500.00/gram. That is stiff.  P50.00/gram is an acceptable investment

3.  The other parts:    seat post, stem, saddle,  drop bar.  Say they total:

                         Seat post           -   350 grams
                         Saddle                    400 grams
                         Alum drop bar         500 grams
                         Stem                       300 grams
                        Total                       1,550 grams

     You can buy China parts from Lazada with substantial savings:  (who cares if they come from China? Mura naman at gagaan bike.

                       Seat post                240 grams
                       Saddle                    150 grams
                       Alum drop bar        250 grams
                       Stem                       200 grams
                       New total                840 grams

                      Weight reduced        710 grams

                       Estimated cost   P5,200/710                    P7.32 /gram a very cost effective method.
                       If you buy from a bike shop, the entire investment may be  P30,000 or morel. An alum drop
                       would cost P15,000 or more, a seat post maybe of an even amount.  A medium priced
                       saddle would cost about P8,000.

4.  Tires and tubes.

       Many readings recommend that this items be given first priority because the  rotating mass is the one being pushed by the rider. It is best to be lightweight and efficient in this area

       Buy lightweight tires and tubes.  You may invest the following:
                                                                                                   Weight reduced
                  Carbon frame                        -  P35,000                      300 grams
                  Carbon wheelset                         30,000                      200 grams
                  High end GS                               30,000                      200 grams

                                                     Total        95,000                     700 grams

        And yet at the end of the day, your bike still feels heavy and sluggish.  Why, because of your tires.  They are heavy.

                Invest in light weight tires and tubes.

                                     Ordinary tires weight                   Lightweight tires              Weight savings

             Tires                       300 grams                                190, 154                              110,  l46

              Tubes                    110                                                   60                                  50

                                                                                              Total                                  160 x 2 = 320

             Imagine that  320 grams saved for let us say investment for

                                    Tires 2,000 x 2                           =   P4,000
                                     Tubes  280 x 2                                     560
                                         Total                                            4,560/320                         14.25/gram

           Cheap and cost effective. How much more if your favorite tire is CST or Panaracer

            Some lightweight  tires from Weight Weenies


             Continental GP    Supersonic                                    -      140 grams

             Kenda Kaliente light                                                         165 grans

            Maxxis Xenith Equipe Legere                                            160 grams

            Panaracer Stradius TT                                                       170 grams

           Schwalbe Ultremo                                                              180 grams

           Veloflex Record Kevlar                                                     140 grams

           Vittoria Diamante Pro light                                                175 grams